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Unread 09-07-2008, 13:51   #1
ThomasJ
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Default [Article] Private park and ride proposed for Clonsilla

From Community Voice (Dublin 15 local newspaper)

http://www.communityvoice.ie/pages/CV118/CV118n05.htm

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Private park & ride proposed for Clonsilla

One of the phrases often used by those advocating greater use of public transport in the area is that of “park and ride” and both the local authority and Iarnród Éireann are regularly castigated for their failure to provide such facilities.

It is the lack of these facilities that have lead to much of the local chaos and aggravation for residents of local estates near Dublin 15’s railway stations.

Local residents and developers Paul and Harry Warnock have now decided to capitalise on this lack of provision by state agencies by offering their own solution to the problem with a privately operated park and ride service in Clonsilla.

Last month the brothers submitted a planning application to Fingal County Council for the provision of a temporary park and ride facility for 280 cars in Clonsilla village. The proposed car park – almost twice the size of the Iarnród Éireann car park in Coolmine would be located on lands at the old Post Office on Clonsilla Road and occupying lands behind the Petrogas filling station and Cunningham’s Funeral Home. According to the plans submitted by the Warnocks, access to the site would be through Weaver’s Walk - the narrow cul de sac opposite the Clonsilla Link Road.

While, on the face of it, the provision of such facilities might seem to be of benefit to the area, Fine Gael local election candidate Kieran Dennison has come out strongly against the proposal.

Speaking to Community Voice he said “this is a private venture and will do nothing to alleviate the chaotic parking in the area. Most commuters will continue to avail of free parking in nearby estates and roads.”

Mr Dennison suggests that the effect of the new park and ride will actually make matters even worse for local commuters “as hundreds more cars from Meath and beyond descend on the Clonsilla Road in the mornings. Local traffic will be held up while they queue up to get in. Those unable to find space will simply dump their vehicles wherever is most convenient before running for the train. As well as the congestion and pollution, there will be the usual problems with litter and vandalism just like Coolmine,” he said.

The planning application is accompanied by a traffic impact assessment prepared by Clifton Scannell Emerson, consulting engineers. This company recently carried out the construction of the Ongar Road for the county council. According to consultants, “the development will include public lighting, CCTV cameras, pay stations and barriers. Access will be provided from a local access road to the west of the site. This will require the modification of the existing junction between the Clonsilla Road and the Clonsilla Link Road creating a new signalised staggered cross roads including the car park entrance road, Clonsilla Road and the new Clonsilla link Road.”

According to the consultants their analysis indicates that “the modified junction has more than enough capacity to cater for the development of a car park on this site while also ensuring junction safety and improving pedestrian facilities.

In the council’s Urban Strategy report, the proposed site was previously identified as a probable development site in the village “with potential for 48 residential units comprising 18 two bed apartments, 27 three bed houses and 3 four bed houses”.

A proposal by previous owners of the site to carry out an apartment development with access through the adjoining Lambourne estate received planning permission from both the county council and an Bórd Pleanála. However this was eventually overturned by the courts following a case taken by the local residents’ association.

The present owners of the site Warnock Construction have already completed other developments in the area including the apartment blocks at The Meadows in Clonsilla. The fact that the building boom has come, in the words of Brian Lenihan TD, to “a shuddering stop” has probably prompted them to make alternative use of the site until the property market improves.

However it is precisely for this reason that Mr. Dennison is opposing the current application. “When this site is eventually built on, those availing of the park will seek to continue parking somewhere else in the area. This is the reason I have always opposed the concept of a park and ride at Clonsilla. There can never be enough spaces for everyone and in any case the area cannot cope with anymore traffic,” he told Community Voice.

A decision on the application is expected by the middle of July.
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Unread 09-07-2008, 14:03   #2
Mark Gleeson
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A park in ride in the centre of a residential area is hardly sensible planning and development. Park and ride works best at the extremities of development, traffic is already fairly horrible

Really the best solution, if you where a little bit clever would be to do a Paton flyer routine, get a few buses on the cheap from Circle line and run a local service via the station
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Unread 09-07-2008, 14:20   #3
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I agree, but given peoples parking patterns at the moment, local residents which are affected by the parking of cars on their road at the moment would be happy for this resolution. Mind you if I remember weavers row it is going to be a nightmare!

Having said that there is a huge green area opposite the area in question that would be more than ideal for this.

If the issues with the BUS plans are resolved quickly enough, the 270 bus route being planned as well as the usual 39s should be a help.
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Unread 09-07-2008, 14:54   #4
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One of my mates lives in Weavers walk.

It is a small cul de sac with 4 one off type houses and each resident is of the quite wealthy type who would not be averse to spending on expensive solicitors. I'd be amazed if this got permission.

Once again the dysfunctional lack of local bus services are at play here.
Maybe the car park boys might consider running a local bus service instead?
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Unread 09-07-2008, 15:08   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Hennessy View Post
One of my mates lives in Weavers walk.

It is a small cul de sac with 4 one off type houses and each resident is of the quite wealthy type who would not be averse to spending on expensive solicitors. I'd be amazed if this got permission.

Once again the dysfunctional lack of local bus services are at play here.
Maybe the car park boys might consider running a local bus service instead?
Mark as you come out of Weavers walk the Ongar link road, to your left on that side there is a huge plot of land sitting there doing nothing. Given the building slump, there is a chance now if ever, to build a carpark needed in the area. I don't know if you have seen it, it is directly opposite as you come out of weavers road oppisite the road leading up to the new ongar road.

Problem is, not everyone will want to give up driving to the station, local bus service or no local bus service and there and this includes people living outside of dublin 15

Last edited by ThomasJ : 09-07-2008 at 15:49.
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Unread 09-07-2008, 18:06   #6
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Ive spent the last 2 years solid advocating local subsidised bus services. It became RUI policy on the matter.Still, the authorities don't get it and they never will until oil hits 200 dollars a barrel. That should do the job.

I'll say it again. Park and ride has failed because it causes huge congestion around station sites at peak hours and ruins the quality of life for people living in the environs. Its unsustainable.

Glad to see Mark G advocating one of my ideas.
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Unread 09-07-2008, 19:48   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Derek Wheeler View Post
Ive spent the last 2 years solid advocating local subsidised bus services. It became RUI policy on the matter.Still, the authorities don't get it and they never will until oil hits 200 dollars a barrel. That should do the job.
Well the PD Tom Morrisey took it up, for the week leading up the election last year

The govt don't want to know about it.
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Unread 10-07-2008, 10:57   #8
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We wont ever see the full benefits and reap the rewards of shuttle buses and connecting buses etc. without integrated ticketing and integrated scheduling. Until then customers will still see a bus ride after they get off the train as another journey rather than a simple connection.

Park & Rides are highly useful and successful when located at the extremities of urban areas and beside major routes. The likes of Pace, Belinstown, Red Cow etc are good examples of this.

Introducing pay parking is the best way to discourage users from driving when kiss&ride, connecting buses (with integrated ticketing), cycling and walking are available (if available).

For the likes of Clonsilla the mantra for the car park must be that it is for passengers that do not live in the local catchment and thus are not served by public transport where they live (or choose not to use it). Pay parking is the only way to weed out the very local park and ride users (lazy) from the commuters who have to drive to the station out of necessity.

Last edited by Mark : 10-07-2008 at 11:20.
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Unread 12-07-2008, 19:34   #9
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I think the posts on Boards regarding cmmuters from Celbridge being left high and dry, but ses Dempsey, there's loads of busses use the N4 qbc and even if none of them serve Celbridge, sher it's not his problem. sus up the Dept of T/FF attitude.
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