Why is the 06:00 Cork to Dublin running 10 minutes late?

[laoisfan]

Hi,

Just wondering can anyone explain why the 06:00 Cork to Dublin train is running consistently 10 minutes late each morning for the last 3 weeks?

This impacts on several other trains, in my case the 07:44 from Ballybrophy and the 08:10 from Portlaoise (I go to Park West).

The guys in the office at Ballybrophy & Portlaoise have been unable (or unwilling) to give an answer.

Leaves? Track works? Driver slept it out?

Anyone?

Thanks.

[laoisfan]

Irish Rail replied to my tweet with the following link.

Linky

[berneyarms]

I'd say it's adhesion problems with the leaves. Same issue every year around this time of year unfortunately.

I don't really think you need to diminish your (legitimate) query with suggestions like "driver slept it out" - that's really a bit below the belt to be honest.

While we all may have gripes, I think that's taking things a bit too far.

[laoisfan]

@berneyarms

In the 3 weeks the 06:00 Cork-Dublin has been running late not a single staff member at Ballybrophy/Portlaoise was able to offer a reason why it was late. RPU staff were unable to offer a reason too. The RPU staff go in/out to the driver's cab a lot so you would think that the driver might know or just mention it in passing to them.

"diminish" seriously? my gripe, like other customers, is that I pay a lot of money over to Irish Rail each year and I would like a certain level of service (I can dream). Delays I can handle. Lack of information I can't handle. Inexcusable.

[Jamie2k9]

Traveled to Cork last week and there was no wheel slip or TSRs in place. Its an excuse which we put up with for 4 months.

Why cant they place one or two hundred more of those things on the rails or ever plaster the rail heads with the grit manually.

The invisible leaves that fall on Irish Railways are amazing!

[laoisfan]

Thanks Jamie2k9, I'm not buying the leaves on the track excuse...certainly not for 3 weeks straight!

[Mark Gleeson]

Train left Cork ontime this morning, arrived Dublin 6 minutes late

Delay issue appeared to be in the North Cork/Tipperary area

[Colm Moore]

I can understand issues since about last Friday, but was there really much leaf fall before that? Given that we had one of the warmest and driest Septembers in a long time? http://www.westmeathexaminer.ie/news...ber-on-record/

[berneyarms]

Originally Posted by laoisfan

@berneyarms

In the 3 weeks the 06:00 Cork-Dublin has been running late not a single staff member at Ballybrophy/Portlaoise was able to offer a reason why it was late. RPU staff were unable to offer a reason too. The RPU staff go in/out to the driver's cab a lot so you would think that the driver might know or just mention it in passing to them.

"diminish" seriously? my gripe, like other customers, is that I pay a lot of money over to Irish Rail each year and I would like a certain level of service (I can dream). Delays I can handle. Lack of information I can't handle. Inexcusable.

I'm not excusing a lack of information - that is just not good enough, and of course you are entitled to an explanation of why the train is running late. I think any delay should be explained. It is something IE are atrocious at.

And thinking about it, leaf fall would really only have impacted since the end of last week. So like you I'm kinda at a loss to explain it - you'd need to be on to them every day.

But let's be honest, including a comment such as "driver slept it out" is a bit insulting to staff. Do you really think that staff are going to turn up late for work on a regular basis? I understand (and agree with) your frustration, but I just think that comment's a bit uncalled for.

[Mark Gleeson]

All the evidence shows the train leaves on time

[berneyarms]

Is there an extra temporary speed restriction (TSR) along the line possibly?

The 06:00 and 07:00 are very tightly timetabled with little slack if an additional TSR is put in place.

[Jamie2k9]

The Limerick shuttle usually has a lot to explain when it comes to OTP. Was that on time.

As for times the same as all routes and gets 5/6 minutes lee way and it would take a lot of TSR to make it late. Given the 07.00 does the same time with an extra stop the 06.00 should of being able to absorb a couple of TSRs if they were in place. Did the 07.00 run to time?

[Thomas J Stamp]

Originally Posted by Mark Gleeson

All the evidence shows the train leaves on time

maybe the driver has a snooze at the junction.

[ACustomer]

The 0600 is not tightly timed, assuming its an ICR. I recently came up from Cork on the 1620, six scheduled stops in 2.45. We arrived 13 minutes early: 2.32 for six stops, so 2.30 for 3 stops should be easy. And by the way there were severe TSRs at Lisduff and Kildare.

[Inniskeen]

Originally Posted by Thomas J Stamp

maybe the driver has a snooze at the junction.

Highly unlikely to be a staff issue - no doubt somebody is late now and again but drivers normally sign on well in advance of scheduled departure time and in any event an alternative driver would typically be available in Cork.

Driving style can significantly affect train punctuality, some drivers drift along at speeds well below the speed limit or are excessively cautious in braking or are slow to accelerate. Some drivers exibit more than one of the above tendencies and consequently services run late as a result.

In this instance I would guess that the predominant issue is a combination of wheelslip, TSRs and perhaps locomotives running with traction motor defects.

[berneyarms]

Originally Posted by ACustomer

The 0600 is not tightly timed, assuming its an ICR. I recently came up from Cork on the 1620, six scheduled stops in 2.45. We arrived 13 minutes early: 2.32 for six stops, so 2.30 for 3 stops should be easy. And by the way there were severe TSRs at Lisduff and Kildare.

It's not an ICR - it's Mark 4 operated.

There is damn all recovery time in the 06:00 schedule.

[Jamie2k9]

And by the way there were severe TSRs at Lisduff and Kildare.

Lisduff can no longer be classed as a TSR, its full time despite bran new points being installed. Such a waste of time and resources if there was no benefit. It would of being factored into timetabling in 2013 anyway.

Kildare has being TSRs for the last year on and off anytime it increase the speeds days lather its back to 25. Its being 25, 40, 50, 70 and 90 for a long time.

The 06.00 is well capable of doing the 2h30m, this mornings 07.00 was in a few minutes early so that puts any excuses of TSR and wheel slip out the window + the extra minute or two at Thurles.

There is damn all recovery time in the 06:00 schedule.

Not an acceptable excuse all the same.

Driving style can significantly affect train punctuality, some drivers drift along at speeds well below the speed limit or are excessively cautious in braking or are slow to accelerate. Some drivers exibit more than one of the above tendencies and consequently services run late as a result.

Drivers should be given a telling off for going under speed and making a service be late and its usually the drivers who spend more time concentrating on the horn instead of their foot.

[berneyarms]

Originally Posted by Jamie2k9

Lisduff can no longer be classed as a TSR, its full time despite bran new points being installed. Such a waste of time and resources if there was no benefit. It would of being factored into timetabling in 2013 anyway.

Kildare has being TSRs for the last year on and off anytime it increase the speeds days lather its back to 25. Its being 25, 40, 50, 70 and 90 for a long time.

The 06.00 is well capable of doing the 2h30m, this mornings 07.00 was in a few minutes early so that puts any excuses of TSR and wheel slip out the window + the extra minute or two at Thurles.



Not an acceptable excuse all the same.



Drivers should be given a telling off for going under speed and making a service be late and its usually the drivers who spend more time concentrating on the horn instead of their foot.

I wasn't making an excuse, so please don't suggest I was. I don't think there is any need for that.

What I was getting at was that if there are any additional TSRs, then the 0600 is likely to be affected as it has little or no recovery built into the schedule.

[Jamie2k9]

But you still don't see my point and that is the 07.00 can complete the same 165 mile journey with an extra stop and the same TSRs in place on time and slightly early so whatever has delayed the 06.00 is either train or driver related. There is no difference between both services apart from the drivers so its either them or a problem with a set.

[Inniskeen]

Over the 19 days between the 7th of September and the 8th of October the 0600 ex Cork was on time or early at Heuston on 5 occasions, no more 5 minutes late on a further 5 occasions and over 10 minutes late on 2 occasions.

Over the same period the 0700 ex Cork was on time or early at Heuston on 8 occasions, no more 5 minutes late on a further 1 occasion and over 10 minutes late on 6 occasions.

If anything the 0700 from Cork is a worse perming service than the 0600 from Cork. Using the IR standard of being on time if arriving within 10 minutes of booked time, the 0600 was on time 89% and the 0700 65%.

The argument about the 0700 v 0600 doesn't appear to have any substance in reality. It may well be the case that the 0600 being late at Portlaoise or other intermediate points is more significant as there is a greater potential to delay other services than is the case an hour later.

The earliest arrival of the 0600 at Heuston was 0825 and the latest 0845. The earliest arrival of the 0700 at Heuston was 0922 and the latest 0953.

Incidentally both trains have 3 intermediate stops.