Lack of toilets facilities at DART stations...

[CorkMan212]

Has anybody on this board ever encountered a DART station on a Saturday morning where the trains are like running at 20 minutes intervals.

First of all I left the house after being left out at around half seven, just five minutes out disaster strikes, 10 minute walk to the DART, then 17 minute wait for the DART and finally 10-15mins in on the DART.

Now couldn't this crisis have been very easily averted if IE just had a few toilets in stations around big areas such as Raheny, etc... I'm not sure do any stations on the North side have toilets but certainly it's just lucky that I crossed my legs! but luck at it this way somebody with an over active bladder or pregnant needs to go, what are they supposed to do? The DART doesn't provide toilets on board. So what is the other solution? I could give a few ideas but I'll make sure next time disaster doesn't repeat itself before leaving the house.

[paddyb180285]

I am from Dalkey myself and I frequently get the DART.I am completely with you on that point.I think it is rediculous that the only stations (I know of) which have toilet facilities are Connolly, Pearse, Dun Laoghaire, Killiney and Bray. As Killiney station is beside the beach there is an accessible toilet in the car park beside the beach and the station. There is no excuse for the lack there of in Tara Street as it is constantly busy. As well as that Tara Street is smack down in the middle of the city centre. Most times, I need to use my house toilet before a 10-15 minute walk to the station itself. I live the same distance from both Dalkey and Glenageary Stations and alternate between the two.

It has happened to me quite a few times before where I feel like using the toilet before boarding the train. 20 minute waits at platforms aren't a big help either as it only makes matters worse. However, if I am lucky enough to get a Commuter train then there is no problem so long as none of the on board restrooms are out of order. Dalkey and occasionally Glenageary are amongst the more prominent stations on the southside apart from Blackrock and Dun Laoghaire. I think there is a big need for PUBLIC Toilet facilities at stations such as Dalkey, Blackrock, Raheny and especially Tara Street. On top of that, they should stay open until the staff go home.

Depending on how bad the situation is, I have often found it to be very uncomfortable waiting the entire length of the journey to use a restroom. This can leave me twitching on the train. The journey can be up to an hour and 20 minutes in length. Alternatively, the entire DART fleet could be fitted with on board toilets. I don't mean every carriage but every two carriages like the Commuters. This would have a lot of long term benefits as the DART system is eventually going to be extended in all directions. This could make the entire journey 2 hours in length. There is bound to be at least a few people making this journey. I am glad I amn't the only one with this opinion.

[Thomas Ralph]

I don't think this would stand up to a cost-benefit exercise. For example on the 8100s you would have to have an accessible toilet in every second carriage, which takes out (by my reckoning) 8 seats and 4+ standing places, that's heading for 50 places lost to an 8-car train and it's not like they have room to burn, particularly at rush-hour.
And that doesn't even start me on how many carriage-journeys would be lost sending the fleet piecemeal for refit...

[MOH]

Originally Posted by paddyb180285

I think there is a big need for PUBLIC Toilet facilities at stations such as Dalkey, Blackrock, Raheny and especially Tara Street. On top of that, they should stay open until the staff go home.

Think I've seen members of the public using the toilet at Blackrock after asking a staff member. Although, that probably depends on whether there's anyone at the desk, and what mood they're in.

[paddyb180285]

I am going to get technical with this point. As far as I know, there are 3 main makes of DART fleet. There is the Alstom DART fleet which can only support 2 carriages from cabin to cabin. Then there is the LHB DART stock with the same configuration albiet with more comfortable seats. Finally, there is the Tokyu DART fleet divided into two sub classes with the only two differences being slight variation in seat comfort and the roof profile. A single train in this form can be 4 carriages in length from cabin to cabin.

The point I am trying to make is that the make of DART would determine the amount of toilets in a single DART train. The Tokyu fleet can form 8 cars with only two trains back to back. Therefore, there would be one toilet on each train. However, 4 trains are required to make an 8 car formation with either the LHB or Alstom DART stock. This would mean installing 4 restrooms on an 8 carriage Alstom or LHB DART train. For each restroom 4 seats would have to be sacrificed. Nevertheless, I don't think that standing space would be affected.

Moving away from the technicalities, an extremely cheap solution would be to place a portable toilet on each platform at the following stations: Dalkey, Blackrock, Sydney Parade, Grand Canal Dock, Tara Street and Raheny. Another suggestion would be to have more Commuter branded trains serving stations such as Raheny, Dalkey and Glenageary. Bray, Dun Laoghaire and Blackrock are quite frequently serviced by this type of train, particularly the former two. Simply add Raheny, Dalkey and partially Glenageary to the list of stops for more of these services. Not all of them but the majority of them. If that makes any sense? The text in bold indicates the stations with a particularly higher demand for this kind of facility.

As I mentioned in an earlier point, Bray, Killiney, Dun Laoghaire, Pearse and Connolly already have toilet facilities. However, some are in desparate need of refurbishment, particularly in Dun Laoghaire. As Malahide and Portmarnock are very frequently serviced by the Commuter, they wouldn't really need a toilet. In other words, every second or third train serving those areas is a Commuter. The bottom line is that either have more stations fitted with toilets or have them fitted on to the DARTs. I won't elaborate any further on this point as I will end up completely exhausting it.

[Mark Gleeson]

Its more like 8-10 seats since the toilet must be accessible

Longest DART trip is 1 hour 15 minutes, average time onboard would be less than half that

[Colm Moore]

Originally Posted by paddyb180285

As Malahide and Portmarnock are very frequently serviced by the Commuter, they wouldn't really need a toilet.

Its been a while, but Malahide does have toilets. It even had a "Ladies Waiting Room" at one time.

[paddyb180285]

Mark, in an earlier point I also mentioned that the DART line will eventually be extended, substantially increasing the average length of a passenger journey. Another point that I would like to make is that Maynooth, although lacking electrification is serviced by the more comfortable Commuter trains. The journey for this is 45 minutes in length. In another thread I also mentioned that I took a return trip up to Maynooth twice in one week at different times. While on board, I noticed a good few passengers using the on board restrooms. Perhaps, this is because the facilities where available.

Nevertheless, I was quite surprised by the demand for this for a 45 minute journey which some may regard as relatively short. I was in college in the IFSC for 4 years until last month. On numerous occassions, the DART would take in excess of 40 minutes to reach Connolly which is where I would usually get off. Having been to the toilet just before leaving the house, at times I would badly need to go again 20 minutes into this 40 minute journey. It certainly wouldn't have been any help being squashed between the abundance of passengers.

On a further note, the reason why I have often suggested making more use out of the Commuter trains particularly those going to and from Bray is because it would spread the amount of passengers accross the trains at these times. Take for example, the morning Balbriggan service from Bray. It serves all stations between Bray and Dun Laoghaire before skipping all stations to Landsdown Road. Well over half the people at Dalkey and Glenageary board this train and the platforms at these stations are covered with people by the time it arrives.

There is another Commuter train between 8:00 and 8:25 from Gorey which serves Dun Laoghaire and then Blackrock. While these stations are important interchanges, it skips Dalkey and Glenageary which are extremely congested at this time. It would make sense to have that service stopping in even one of those stations to distribute the passengers more evenly so that the following trains are not as clogged up. To be fair this service cruises along between Blackrock and Landsdown Road. Would it not make sense have one extra stop to this services?

For example, the train from Gorey could make a stop in Dalkey at 8:15 allowing the DART in front to get further ahead. It would arrive in Dun Laoghaire 2 minutes later then it currently does. From here on it would be able to pick up a lot more speed as 2 minutes of clearence would give the train driver the ability to go much faster. It would arrive in town at the same time it is currently. However, a lot more passengers will benefit from the extra stop.

I have been on the 10:36 Drogheda (leaves Bray at 10:25) service from Dalkey loads of times. As the train before it is much further ahead, it speeds along between Dun Laoghaire and Blackrock at roughly 50 MPH. This should more than make up for those 2 extra minutes.

[dowlingm]

as the population ages this issue will become, erm, more pressing...

[losexpectation]

didn't he say at dart stations rather then on darts

[dowlingm]

Originally Posted by losexpectation

didn't he say at dart stations rather then on darts

that only works in an extended DART system if you can get off the train and use it within the fare paid area and re-embark. That might work on the metro but DART is a longer wait.

[Colm Moore]

Note Adamstown (paid side??) and Parkwest (paid side) both have public toilets. They don't charge.