Why no trains after 7?

[Padraic]

A friend of mine here in London just got back from Ireland. Apparently she and her boyfriend turned up at Heuston station one evening last week trying to get a train to Kilkenny. They turned up just before 7pm to be told the last train to Kilkenny had left. They ended up staying the night in Dublin before catching the train in the morning.

In this day and age I find this incredible.

What is stopping Iarnrod Eireann from running at least an hourly service from Dublin to Waterford up to maybe 11pm at night? Surely these antiquated timetables should be consigned to the dustbin - ?

[packetswitch]

Here's another one. The last train to anywhere in Wicklow/Wexford south of Greystones (i.e. both 'commuter' and 'long-distance' elements of the Rosslare line), leaves Dublin at 6.30pm. Which, in many cases, is far too early.

(Yet a train now leaves Gorey at 6am, so why not run a service that leaves Dublin at 9pm and goes at least to Gorey, I presume it has to be positioned somehow?)

[Mark Gleeson]

Irish Rail refuse to consider later trains. We went through this with Port Laois last year which would have the highest demand. Though when the new maintenance facility opens there will be services late into the evening to Port Laois to shuttle the trains around

The real issue is to operate to Gorey/Longford/Killkenny later than now would require the train to stay overnight and since they are staffed by Dublin drivers that won't happen, they all return in service to Dublin that night. We had the farce of sticking the drivers for the morning Longford trains in a taxi from Connolly a few years ago, it took years to fix

Word is a later train to Gorey is likely but depends on staff being based there. In general later trains out of Heuston station are off the agenda until at least 2009 as many evening trains will be cancelled on and off while the 4 track project is ongoing to Hazelhatch

Last train to Carlow is 20:05, Killkenny is over 80 miles from Dublin many places a lot closer have no service after 6:35pm so its not on the priority list, in fact it would be bad idea in transport planning to further encourage long distance commuting

[packetswitch]

Originally Posted by Mark Gleeson

in fact it would be bad idea in transport planning to further encourage long distance commuting

Much as I'd like to agree, I think that ship has sailed. Long-distance commuting is a reality and until they start blowing up motorways (or bringing down Dublin prices), it's not going away. Commuters live in Portlaoise/Arklow/etc, we can hardly tell them that they have lots of shiny new roads but we can't give them trains because that would encourage commuting

[Mark Gleeson]

Portlaoise/Arklow/etc,

are 50 miles out, Killkenny is 80 miles out there is a difference

Further out you go the more inefficient the service becomes, then you reach a point where the very long distance demand faster trains and fewer stops which in turn saps precious capacity from the higher density commuting stations

[Gary]

Originally Posted by Mark Gleeson

The real issue is to operate to Gorey/Longford/Killkenny later than now would require the train to stay overnight and since they are staffed by Dublin drivers that won't happen, they all return in service to Dublin that night. We had the farce of sticking the drivers for the morning Longford trains in a taxi from Connolly a few years ago, it took years to fix

Could they not just return the train to dublin, empty if needs be?

[Mark Gleeson]

Most come back in service now, but if they left Dublin later they get back later, on the Kildare line the line may be closed for engineering works

On the Gorey route train would come back empty to Drogheda and then go Drogheda Gorey at 4am, logical solution is to leave the train overnight and have a local driver to drive avoiding the massive round trips, also means the morning service is much more reliable and slashes costs which is the key reason the service doesn't exist now

There are no drivers in Gorey or Killkenny and those in Portlaois are not on the passenger roster

[Colm Donoghue]

The fact Irish rail have no drivers shouldn't be our problem.
it's bad enough they don't have enough trains.

for example, the last train to Galway tonight is at five past seven.
The last BE bus is at nine, the last citilink is at 10 o' clock.

BE go to kilkenny at 20:30 so there is demand.

[Mark Gleeson]

Well its the reality and it takes 24 months to sort. We know the issues so we can cut through the first level of obstruction IE will place in our path. Public have a right to know the real reasons not the usual lack of demand excuse. That said you need to be looking at least 50 per train to make a case

Secondary problem is the train that left at 6pm has to travel so far to the far reaches of the commuter belts that they can't get back to run a usable later service, thats a serious issue. So if a train travels 10 miles less it can be back 20 minutes earlier that also has shift length implications and so on

And we all know of the lack of rolling stock, again IE try to hide from this but the proof is there

They have totally missed the social change of the last 10 years but I would argue that its places such as Wicklow, Arklow, Mullingar, Port Laois (within the 30-50 mile ring) should be priorities for later services and that extreme long distance commuting (+50miles) should be actively discouraged. Doing so provides an enhanced service to the busier closer to Dublin area, better use of resources etc

[Oisin88]

Originally Posted by colmd

The fact Irish rail have no drivers shouldn't be our problem.
it's bad enough they don't have enough trains.

for example, the last train to Galway tonight is at five past seven.
The last BE bus is at nine, the last citilink is at 10 o' clock.

BE go to kilkenny at 20:30 so there is demand.

Bus Eireann have started to put on some very late services, like the ones to Letterkenny leaving as late as 10:45pm through the airport.

http://www.buseireann.ie/site/your_j...sway/32new.pdf

Also, I wonder will there be any changes to operating hours from benchmarking. The last round of benchmarking pay was dependent on public servants demonstrating more flexibility, which has meant that some grades e.g. radiologists in hospitals, have changed working hours.