A Christmas Tale: My (re-)introduction to Irish Public Transport #2

apwhite · 23-12-2005, 00:09

I'm on a roll here...

Anyway after a couple of hours fun and frolics in the wonderfully leafy and serene city centre it was time to head back home. I was in the vicinity of Stephens Green so I decided to be a daredevil and get the Luas (I had read somewhere that there were bus connections to Blackrock from Dundrum station). This went well, lovely Luas station, displays telling you the time of the next Luas! Shelter!! Seats!!! Bliss.

I was impressed with the Luas. Fast efficient, but hell it's only a baby so one could expect such luxuries. Dundrum approached and duely the lovely lady (and the LED display) intoned over the PA to change here for Blackrock. Now unfortunately she forgot to tell me which bus would whisk me down home (in Germany they rattle off all connection possibilites with the name of each bus / line). I thought no more about it, reckoning there would be a pristine Information board at Dundrum station. I got off and searched in vain. No "You are here" map of the surroundings (with other transport stops marked on it), no connection information, not even a piece of cardboard nailed to the wall with "Bus stop this way" written on it.

I don't know Dundrum too well, but I did know that Blackrock was due right of the station so I decided to walk that way to find a bus stop. Aha! Within 100m or so I found one. Unfortunately there was no timetable, hell there wasn't even a sign saying which busses stopped there. I waited 20 minutes and got very annoyed. After 30 minutes I played "Who Wants To Be A Millionaire" and phoned a friend. They told me that to the best of their knowledge, no bus served Taney Road. Bah f**king Humbug a disused Bus stop that they haven't gotten round to taking down.

Back down to Dundrum village and now it's time to ask the locals like a pleb. The first dude was Irish and had no clue, the second was an unfortunate pole (the race, not a bar of metal just standing there) who told me that I wanted the 17 and the bus stop should be just down the road. So off I marched praising the Pope and Lech Walensa. Eventually I found the stop, but yet again there was no timetable or information as to which bus stopped there... So I just stood there and hoped... and waited and hoped... and waited...

While I was composing my second open letter to the Department of Transport, Irish precipitation rule #12 took effect ("it will always rain when you least expect it") and it started to drizzle. Now we have two facts in Ireland: 1) It rains a lot. 2) Public transport frequency is low at the best of times. Then why pray tell do only a handful of bus stops have shelters??? Especially not the one I was standing at... Better still there was a very old chap beside me who looked like he had been standing there since the easter rising and could use a nice sit down (and a cup of tea). Also a no show. Seats? Real men stand.

So I waited and waited and after 30 minutes a 17 dutiful showed up, at which time I was 98% water. By now a small flock of people had accumulated and when we entered the bus, nearly all of us had to buy tickets... The crazy thought struck me, that while we were waiting for the bus we could have all bought a ticket (if there was a ticket machine at the bus stop) and saved everyone at least 3 minutes. If they can fit solar powered parking ticket machines on small suburban street why couldn't Dublin Bus (like those sensible, but oh so boring Germans ) equip their stops with ticket machines??? And don't even get me started on the fact that I had to pay 1 Luas fare and 1 Dublin bus fare to get home...

I got home and started my open letter, during which I started doing some research on the subject and lo and behold I stumbled upon a little known organisation called Platform11 which I have since come to look at more often than the news.

Anyway, Happy Christmas To All!

ps. Did I tell you the one about being delayed for an hour on the train to Kilkenny? Or about the 20 minute wait between Darts during the day?? Or the fact that there were no Darts at the weekend all summer long??? Or the one about the red line being way over capacity at rush hour????

alek smart · 23-12-2005, 10:54

Gosh APW...a very real case of Vorsprung Durch Technik or not as the case may be.....
A Little O/T but perhaps U can shed a little clear white light....Are you aware of the German Cities which have traditionally had a Multi-Door boarding Bus system ?
I have read some items,which I cannot now find,which referred to several German cities reverting to FRONT DOOR boarding only on all of their systems and reintroducing the requirement for the Dammen und Herren to display ALL tickets to the driver.

My interest in this is that,if tis true, it rather undermines my quest to reduce the amount of faffing about with the Busdriver which Customers are currently required to engage in.

Kevin K Kelehan · 23-12-2005, 11:26

Happy Christmas Mr Alek

It is a good point you raise in relation to nailing down whether ourselves and the equally backward UK (in bus terms) are the only European examples of single door buses.

I always liked the German model of no ticket inspection and hefty fine for non-compliance as it serves to increase honesty across society as a whole.

In relation to AP's story it reminds me of James Nix's story of his friend who one Monday buys a car after being frustrated off public transport the previous evening.

apwhite · 23-12-2005, 11:55

Alek: In the cities I lived in (Bielefeld, Cologne & Frankfurt), the general rule was board by both doors until 20:30, from then on (presumably when it's nice and quiet) board by the driver and everyone has to show tickets. In practise the drivers don't really even look at you when you present them your ticket so you might as well show them a naked picture of Britney Spears... But still the rear door works to let people off.

For the germans it's not very logical, as people who don't buy tickets would travel during the day

But then again they probably realize that the direct & opportunity costs of a bus sitting at a stop for 5 minutes while people board via 1 door and have to either buy tickets or stick an existing ticket in a machine that always seems to go "beep beep beep" are too high and that people (given a certain standard of living) are generally honest and will buy a ticket. And as Kevin said there are quite a number of undercover "revenue protection agents" (I love that Euphemism) i.e. Ticket inspectors floating round during the day who will whack an instant 60EUR fine on you if you don't have a ticket.

Well I still haven't bought a car so I am left at the mercy of Public Transport (or my trusty bike).

ps. I am travelling to Kilkenny tonight, train will probably be chockkers. In Gerrrrmany (roll r), I would have reserved a seat over the internet, paid for and printed my ticket out. But that is obviously too much to ask from IE

Mark Gleeson · 23-12-2005, 12:15

The 17 has been crying out for a better service for years, I had to use it going to school, gave up and got a bike, it links Blackrock, UCD, Drundrum and it manages to find its way to Dolphins Barn i.e the red luas line

That must rank as the best post so far on the new board

Quote:

Originally Posted by apwhite

ps. I am travelling to Kilkenny tonight, train will probably be chockkers. In Gerrrrmany (roll r), I would have reserved a seat over the internet, paid for and printed my ticket out. But that is obviously too much to ask from IE

To be fair you can book online and collect from a machine in Heuston, and yes you can book seats on the 18:25 to Waterford today, that said we know the system is little flaky

PaulM · 23-12-2005, 22:23

I'm deleting that, it's off topic. Only joking! Easily the best post on the new board. It must be though having to deal with this level of incompetance after years of efficiency.

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23-12-2005, 00:09	#1
apwhite New to the board Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 15	A Christmas Tale: My (re-)introduction to Irish Public Transport #2 I'm on a roll here... Anyway after a couple of hours fun and frolics in the wonderfully leafy and serene city centre it was time to head back home. I was in the vicinity of Stephens Green so I decided to be a daredevil and get the Luas (I had read somewhere that there were bus connections to Blackrock from Dundrum station). This went well, lovely Luas station, displays telling you the time of the next Luas! Shelter!! Seats!!! Bliss. I was impressed with the Luas. Fast efficient, but hell it's only a baby so one could expect such luxuries. Dundrum approached and duely the lovely lady (and the LED display) intoned over the PA to change here for Blackrock. Now unfortunately she forgot to tell me which bus would whisk me down home (in Germany they rattle off all connection possibilites with the name of each bus / line). I thought no more about it, reckoning there would be a pristine Information board at Dundrum station. I got off and searched in vain. No "You are here" map of the surroundings (with other transport stops marked on it), no connection information, not even a piece of cardboard nailed to the wall with "Bus stop this way" written on it. I don't know Dundrum too well, but I did know that Blackrock was due right of the station so I decided to walk that way to find a bus stop. Aha! Within 100m or so I found one. Unfortunately there was no timetable, hell there wasn't even a sign saying which busses stopped there. I waited 20 minutes and got very annoyed. After 30 minutes I played "Who Wants To Be A Millionaire" and phoned a friend. They told me that to the best of their knowledge, no bus served Taney Road. Bah f**king Humbug a disused Bus stop that they haven't gotten round to taking down. Back down to Dundrum village and now it's time to ask the locals like a pleb. The first dude was Irish and had no clue, the second was an unfortunate pole (the race, not a bar of metal just standing there) who told me that I wanted the 17 and the bus stop should be just down the road. So off I marched praising the Pope and Lech Walensa. Eventually I found the stop, but yet again there was no timetable or information as to which bus stopped there... So I just stood there and hoped... and waited and hoped... and waited... While I was composing my second open letter to the Department of Transport, Irish precipitation rule #12 took effect ("it will always rain when you least expect it") and it started to drizzle. Now we have two facts in Ireland: 1) It rains a lot. 2) Public transport frequency is low at the best of times. Then why pray tell do only a handful of bus stops have shelters??? Especially not the one I was standing at... Better still there was a very old chap beside me who looked like he had been standing there since the easter rising and could use a nice sit down (and a cup of tea). Also a no show. Seats? Real men stand. So I waited and waited and after 30 minutes a 17 dutiful showed up, at which time I was 98% water. By now a small flock of people had accumulated and when we entered the bus, nearly all of us had to buy tickets... The crazy thought struck me, that while we were waiting for the bus we could have all bought a ticket (if there was a ticket machine at the bus stop) and saved everyone at least 3 minutes. If they can fit solar powered parking ticket machines on small suburban street why couldn't Dublin Bus (like those sensible, but oh so boring Germans ) equip their stops with ticket machines??? And don't even get me started on the fact that I had to pay 1 Luas fare and 1 Dublin bus fare to get home... I got home and started my open letter, during which I started doing some research on the subject and lo and behold I stumbled upon a little known organisation called Platform11 which I have since come to look at more often than the news. Anyway, Happy Christmas To All! ps. Did I tell you the one about being delayed for an hour on the train to Kilkenny? Or about the 20 minute wait between Darts during the day?? Or the fact that there were no Darts at the weekend all summer long??? Or the one about the red line being way over capacity at rush hour????

23-12-2005, 10:54	#2
alek smart Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 144	Gosh APW...a very real case of Vorsprung Durch Technik or not as the case may be..... A Little O/T but perhaps U can shed a little clear white light....Are you aware of the German Cities which have traditionally had a Multi-Door boarding Bus system ? I have read some items,which I cannot now find,which referred to several German cities reverting to FRONT DOOR boarding only on all of their systems and reintroducing the requirement for the Dammen und Herren to display ALL tickets to the driver. My interest in this is that,if tis true, it rather undermines my quest to reduce the amount of faffing about with the Busdriver which Customers are currently required to engage in.

23-12-2005, 11:26	#3
Kevin K Kelehan Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: West Tower Posts: 355	Happy Christmas Mr Alek It is a good point you raise in relation to nailing down whether ourselves and the equally backward UK (in bus terms) are the only European examples of single door buses. I always liked the German model of no ticket inspection and hefty fine for non-compliance as it serves to increase honesty across society as a whole. In relation to AP's story it reminds me of James Nix's story of his friend who one Monday buys a car after being frustrated off public transport the previous evening.

23-12-2005, 11:55	#4
apwhite New to the board Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 15	Alek: In the cities I lived in (Bielefeld, Cologne & Frankfurt), the general rule was board by both doors until 20:30, from then on (presumably when it's nice and quiet) board by the driver and everyone has to show tickets. In practise the drivers don't really even look at you when you present them your ticket so you might as well show them a naked picture of Britney Spears... But still the rear door works to let people off. For the germans it's not very logical, as people who don't buy tickets would travel during the day But then again they probably realize that the direct & opportunity costs of a bus sitting at a stop for 5 minutes while people board via 1 door and have to either buy tickets or stick an existing ticket in a machine that always seems to go "beep beep beep" are too high and that people (given a certain standard of living) are generally honest and will buy a ticket. And as Kevin said there are quite a number of undercover "revenue protection agents" (I love that Euphemism) i.e. Ticket inspectors floating round during the day who will whack an instant 60EUR fine on you if you don't have a ticket. Well I still haven't bought a car so I am left at the mercy of Public Transport (or my trusty bike). ps. I am travelling to Kilkenny tonight, train will probably be chockkers. In Gerrrrmany (roll r), I would have reserved a seat over the internet, paid for and printed my ticket out. But that is obviously too much to ask from IE

23-12-2005, 22:23	#6
PaulM Really Regular Poster Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 826	I'm deleting that, it's off topic. Only joking! Easily the best post on the new board. It must be though having to deal with this level of incompetance after years of efficiency.