Redevelopment of Kent Station in Cork

Jamie2k9 · 21-02-2013, 15:37

Just after hearing that Irish Rail plan a redevelopment of Kent Station in Cork in the near future. Now the station is in need of it but is it really necessary given the company's financial situation and if its Irish Rail paying? should this not be spend else where in areas that are in serous need of it. Train maintenance would be once that comes to mind, repairing track problems, lifting TSR across the network and so on instead of paying for something that is needed but would get by without it.

The project is at design phase and a planning application in within 3 months.

Does anyone know know further details about the proposed works and cost involved.

comcor · 21-02-2013, 20:21

Or maybe spend it on Blarney and Kilbarry stations which might increase numbers into Kent.

As I understand it, the redevelopment is pretty minor, but does finally include an entrance on the quayside.

Inniskeen · 22-02-2013, 11:03

There were all sorts of Celtic era plans for Cork as well as Galway and Waterford.

Hard to see how major re-development could be justified in Cork at this point given that the existing station (while anything but perfect) clearly has more than ample capacity to handle traffic well in excess of current levels.

Colm Moore · 22-02-2013, 13:49

I don't know exactly what is proposed, but there is the problem that the station is surrounded by one-way streets

Kent Station, Lower Glanmire Road, Cork to St. Patrick's Street, Cork - 2.1km http://maps.google.ie/maps?saddr=Low...sz=17&t=m&z=15

St. Patrick's Street, Cork to Kent Station, Lower Glanmire Road, Cork - 1km http://maps.google.ie/maps?saddr=Mer...=prev&t=m&z=15

jacko · 22-02-2013, 13:53

was announced as part of a cork package last week

http://www.transport.ie/pressRelease.aspx?Id=723

nmagner · 08-03-2013, 21:16

I think it will be just more tinkering around at the periphiries of the station.

comcor · 08-03-2013, 22:58

A little tinkering could go a long way. If an entrance could be opened on the south or west side of the station, not only would it take time off the walk into town, but bus services could be moved to Railway St. That could take 5 mins off the round trip to the station on the 205 and 226, giving efficiencies there. It would also mean that the 207, 208 and 212 could easily be diverted to go past the station. Suddenly, large parts of the city would be connected to the station.

comcor · 19-02-2014, 14:46

Quote:

€3m will be used to improve access to Kent rail station, with a new entrance from Horgan's Quay.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0219/505...rt-investment/

I love a good re-announcement.

I'm sure the cost of fixing the roof is bundled in here.

comcor · 02-03-2015, 10:41

It's re-announcement time again

http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland...on-315409.html

However, we do get a date this time.

In terms of the public transport interchange, it's my understanding that in addition to the 205 and 226, which already serve the station, the city terminus of the 206 will move there, which will mean a direct bus route to Douglas. Also, the 221 service to Glanmire, which already goes past the station outbound will stop there in both directions.

It does make sense to terminate buses from West Cork there, not least because it will relieve pressure on Parnell Place bus station, but I haven't heard of any definite plans.

Inniskeen · 03-03-2015, 08:54

The reconfiguration of both the station and bus services you mention would establish the type of arrangement which is so standard in more developed European countries - the Hauptbahnhof is the hub for both rail and road. Translink have done this at various locations in NI and are proposing a dramatic expansion of rail and bus facilities at Great Victoria Street in Belfast to create a transport hub for the city.

dowlingm · 03-03-2015, 15:51

Yeah but in those countries Inniskeen the publicly owned bus and rail enterprises aren't usually engaged in a way to the death...

Inniskeen · 03-03-2015, 20:24

The NTA pays for both and indeed contracts for the services provided.

berneyarms · 03-03-2015, 20:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inniskeen

The NTA pays for both and indeed contracts for the services provided.

The NTA doesn't pay for Bus Eireann Expressway services - these are operated on a commercial basis and self-funded.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dowlingm

Yeah but in those countries Inniskeen the publicly owned bus and rail enterprises aren't usually engaged in a way to the death...

Really dowlingm - if Bus Eireann withdrew all of their expressway services that ran along railway routes, you can be damn sure that another private operator would fill their shoes, so I really think that is a pointless argument. There is a market for both services, which can be seen by observing the loadings on both (which you clearly cannot do as you're not in the country).

None of the services that will potentially operate from Kent Station will be in competition with the rail service - they will complement it.

Inniskeen · 04-03-2015, 07:08

Ok Bus Eireann Expressway is self funded but the NTA still calls the tune in relation to policy. There is minimal integration of servics even where both rail and bus use the same facility.

For example, in response to a query to Irish Rail as to why the Kilkee bus leaves Ennis ten minutes before the train arrives the stock response was that there was no demand for a through service.

berneyarms · 04-03-2015, 07:47

And that is now beginning to change as the NTA reviews the PSO network.

dowlingm · 04-03-2015, 19:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inniskeen

Ok Bus Eireann Expressway is self funded but the NTA still calls the tune in relation to policy. There is minimal integration of servics even where both rail and bus use the same facility.

For example, in response to a query to Irish Rail as to why the Kilkee bus leaves Ennis ten minutes before the train arrives the stock response was that there was no demand for a through service.

There was also the situation where a taxi had to be used to ferry Waterford-Rosslare railcrew back to Waterford at significant expense because the BE Rosslare-Waterford bus (which the crew could have used for free) would not be deferred about 20 minutes.

comcor · 24-01-2017, 11:34

Here's an interesting one.

Despite the original communicated time being summer 2016, the Evening Echo are reporting that the redevelopment work will be completed 'on time' this summer.

http://www.eveningecho.ie/cork-news/...edule/2614045/

ACustomer · 24-01-2017, 20:44

Quote:

Despite the original communicated time being summer 2016, the Evening Echo are reporting that the redevelopment work will be completed 'on time' this summer.

What do you expect in a post-truth age? Answer: "alternative facts" such as this.

comcor · 28-06-2017, 09:34

Timeframe is now for the end of the summer

This article contains a few pictures for those interested

http://www.eveningecho.ie/corknews/N...aa3b73d3560-ds

comcor · 07-09-2017, 12:37

No sign of that entrance that was opening on time this summer being opened...

In the meantime, the issue of development on the larger area of the site has reared its head again

http://www.irishexaminer.com/breakin...de-804981.html

It's not clear whether CIE will get 10% of the development value (€16m) or 10% of the future rental income (approx €900K pa based on Cork commerical yields).

There's an interestingly located train in the first image. At the moment, that line is only used for empty workings (back in the day, the really early train to Dublin used to use it by leaving towards Cobh and doubling back). I hope it means that the line will be retained. While there's absolutely no need for additional platforms towards Dublin/Mallow/Killarney at the moment, the land should be held back in case it is ever needed in the future.

21-02-2013, 15:37	#1
Jamie2k9 Really Really Regluar Poster Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 2,146	Redevelopment of Kent Station in Cork Just after hearing that Irish Rail plan a redevelopment of Kent Station in Cork in the near future. Now the station is in need of it but is it really necessary given the company's financial situation and if its Irish Rail paying? should this not be spend else where in areas that are in serous need of it. Train maintenance would be once that comes to mind, repairing track problems, lifting TSR across the network and so on instead of paying for something that is needed but would get by without it. The project is at design phase and a planning application in within 3 months. Does anyone know know further details about the proposed works and cost involved.

22-02-2013, 13:49	#4
Colm Moore Local Liaison Officer Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 5,442	I don't know exactly what is proposed, but there is the problem that the station is surrounded by one-way streets Kent Station, Lower Glanmire Road, Cork to St. Patrick's Street, Cork - 2.1km http://maps.google.ie/maps?saddr=Low...sz=17&t=m&z=15 St. Patrick's Street, Cork to Kent Station, Lower Glanmire Road, Cork - 1km http://maps.google.ie/maps?saddr=Mer...=prev&t=m&z=15 __________________

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21-02-2013, 20:21	#2
comcor Really Regular Poster Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Cork-Dublin, Cork Commuter and occasionally DART and Dublin-Wexford Posts: 855	Or maybe spend it on Blarney and Kilbarry stations which might increase numbers into Kent. As I understand it, the redevelopment is pretty minor, but does finally include an entrance on the quayside.

22-02-2013, 11:03	#3
Inniskeen Really Regular Poster Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 951	There were all sorts of Celtic era plans for Cork as well as Galway and Waterford. Hard to see how major re-development could be justified in Cork at this point given that the existing station (while anything but perfect) clearly has more than ample capacity to handle traffic well in excess of current levels.

22-02-2013, 13:53	#5
jacko Regular Poster Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 137	was announced as part of a cork package last week http://www.transport.ie/pressRelease.aspx?Id=723

08-03-2013, 21:16	#6
nmagner New to the board Join Date: Mar 2013 Posts: 3	I think it will be just more tinkering around at the periphiries of the station.

08-03-2013, 22:58	#7
comcor Really Regular Poster Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Cork-Dublin, Cork Commuter and occasionally DART and Dublin-Wexford Posts: 855	A little tinkering could go a long way. If an entrance could be opened on the south or west side of the station, not only would it take time off the walk into town, but bus services could be moved to Railway St. That could take 5 mins off the round trip to the station on the 205 and 226, giving efficiencies there. It would also mean that the 207, 208 and 212 could easily be diverted to go past the station. Suddenly, large parts of the city would be connected to the station.

02-03-2015, 10:41	#9
comcor Really Regular Poster Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Cork-Dublin, Cork Commuter and occasionally DART and Dublin-Wexford Posts: 855	It's re-announcement time again http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland...on-315409.html However, we do get a date this time. In terms of the public transport interchange, it's my understanding that in addition to the 205 and 226, which already serve the station, the city terminus of the 206 will move there, which will mean a direct bus route to Douglas. Also, the 221 service to Glanmire, which already goes past the station outbound will stop there in both directions. It does make sense to terminate buses from West Cork there, not least because it will relieve pressure on Parnell Place bus station, but I haven't heard of any definite plans.

03-03-2015, 08:54	#10
Inniskeen Really Regular Poster Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 951	The reconfiguration of both the station and bus services you mention would establish the type of arrangement which is so standard in more developed European countries - the Hauptbahnhof is the hub for both rail and road. Translink have done this at various locations in NI and are proposing a dramatic expansion of rail and bus facilities at Great Victoria Street in Belfast to create a transport hub for the city.

03-03-2015, 15:51	#11
dowlingm Really Really Regluar Poster Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 1,371	Yeah but in those countries Inniskeen the publicly owned bus and rail enterprises aren't usually engaged in a way to the death...

03-03-2015, 20:24	#12
Inniskeen Really Regular Poster Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 951	The NTA pays for both and indeed contracts for the services provided.

04-03-2015, 07:08	#14
Inniskeen Really Regular Poster Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 951	Ok Bus Eireann Expressway is self funded but the NTA still calls the tune in relation to policy. There is minimal integration of servics even where both rail and bus use the same facility. For example, in response to a query to Irish Rail as to why the Kilkee bus leaves Ennis ten minutes before the train arrives the stock response was that there was no demand for a through service.

04-03-2015, 07:47	#15
berneyarms Really Regular Poster Join Date: Aug 2013 Posts: 602	And that is now beginning to change as the NTA reviews the PSO network.

24-01-2017, 11:34	#17
comcor Really Regular Poster Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Cork-Dublin, Cork Commuter and occasionally DART and Dublin-Wexford Posts: 855	Here's an interesting one. Despite the original communicated time being summer 2016, the Evening Echo are reporting that the redevelopment work will be completed 'on time' this summer. http://www.eveningecho.ie/cork-news/...edule/2614045/

28-06-2017, 09:34	#19
comcor Really Regular Poster Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Cork-Dublin, Cork Commuter and occasionally DART and Dublin-Wexford Posts: 855	Timeframe is now for the end of the summer This article contains a few pictures for those interested http://www.eveningecho.ie/corknews/N...aa3b73d3560-ds

07-09-2017, 12:37	#20
comcor Really Regular Poster Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Cork-Dublin, Cork Commuter and occasionally DART and Dublin-Wexford Posts: 855	No sign of that entrance that was opening on time this summer being opened... In the meantime, the issue of development on the larger area of the site has reared its head again http://www.irishexaminer.com/breakin...de-804981.html It's not clear whether CIE will get 10% of the development value (€16m) or 10% of the future rental income (approx €900K pa based on Cork commerical yields). There's an interestingly located train in the first image. At the moment, that line is only used for empty workings (back in the day, the really early train to Dublin used to use it by leaving towards Cobh and doubling back). I hope it means that the line will be retained. While there's absolutely no need for additional platforms towards Dublin/Mallow/Killarney at the moment, the land should be held back in case it is ever needed in the future.